On this week’s episode of Slate’s sports podcast Hang Up and Listen, Stefan Fatsis and Josh Levin spoke with the Atlantic’s Derek Thompson about his piece “American Meritocracy Is Killing Youth Sports.” In that story, Thompson writes, “Declining athletic participation is a prime example of how the choices even benevolent rich households make can hurt poorer families, especially their children.” You can listen to the whole conversation by clicking on the audio player below, and a condensed and edited transcript of their discussion is below.